Phil Rickaby
Welcome to Episode 235 of Stageworthy I’m your host Phil Rickaby. Stageworthy is a podcast about people in Canadian theatre featuring conversations with actors, directors, playwrights and more. My guest this week is Lucy Eveleigh.

You know, a while back, I had the producers of the playmate podcast, Laura Mullin and Chris Tolley his guests. That’s back in Episode 113. Now, play me from CBC podcast is proud to present a new series, The show must go on featuring exciting productions from some of Canada’s top creators, including Hannah Moscovitch, Drew Hayden Taylor, David Yess, Chloe Hung and Anna Chatterton. Each month, enjoy a new show from the comfort of your own home to theatres have closed but the show will go on. You can subscribe to play me wherever you get your podcasts. Now if you’ve been listening to Stageworthy, For a while, or maybe you’re a first time listener and you are listening through a link that you got on the website or through social media Did you know that you can subscribe so that you never miss an episode. You can do that by searching for stage or the on Apple podcast, Google podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts and clicking on the handy subscribe button. And then every week the new episode of stage where they will be delivered right to your device. And if you subscribe, let me know that you’re a new subscriber. You can find Stageworthy on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram @stageworthypod and the website where you can find the archive of all 232 episodes is it stageworthypodcast.com. As I mentioned, my guest this week is Lucy Eveleigh. Lucy is the executive director of the Toronto fringe and the president of the Canadian Association of fringe festivals. We had some technical problems getting started, which you’ll hear us refer to but once we got going we had a great conversation.

We’ll recap a little bit of what we tried to talk about before but, but first, like, how are you doing?

Lucy Eveleigh
I, you know, I’m doing okay. I’m very, very lucky in the grand scheme of things. I feel very grateful, you know, the fringe is still going, I still have a team. I have, you know, I’m very, I’m in a great neighbourhood with you know, I’m doing okay. I think it’s, you know, I was talking to Laura today managing director and we were saying about how it just comes in waves in terms of the fact that it’s not happening this summer. And there are little things that happen where you just kind of go, Oh, that’s too bad, you know. And so on the whole I feel like what I’m I’m really having a positive outlook on what’s gonna come out of this and what the opportunities are that are going to be presented to us, because we’re not doing a festival in the same way. But certainly, I’ve been sad and frustrated and all of the emotions I think people are feeling right now. Yeah. Yeah.

Phil Rickaby
There must be moments throughout this as we get closer to when the fringe would have happened, where it’s like things that were in your calendar for getting the programme information and organising all of that stuff that must be like those are coming up and each one is will be like a reminder that fringe isn’t happening.

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, yeah, we’re trying to archive a lot of that stuff. So so that’s good, a sad reminder. But certainly in our in our shared calendar, there’s things coming up that are shared critical path of things that were set to happen exactly that all of the artists forms that we’re going to go out and expected to come back in and yeah, so it’s certainly going to be a reminder

Phil Rickaby
Yeah, I had I had a trip to London planned. And after it had to be cancelled, the airlines still sent me a reminder to check in for my flight. Oh, no. Just say imagine that like in your calendar, there’s all these little minor landmines. They’re almost the same as like getting getting that kind of that kind of.

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

Phil Rickaby
So we were talking just previously, before we ran into some technical difficulties about when the decision was made to to cancel the fringe for the summer.

Lucy Eveleigh
Yes, I mean, I think, you know, we’ve been sort of having conversations as things were happening, we, you know, meeting daily into and checking the news and see what the reports were. And I think, you know, when I had been talking to Naomi from Luminato, and when that happened, I thought, well, we’re next in line and so we and then when the city basically said they weren’t issuing permits after or until June 30. PostScript or patio is a city permitted event and yeah, and and so we sort of thought well, okay, that’s that’s not going to happen. And then we started to talk about what kind of quality of festival we could offer if we weren’t going to, or if we were going to go small, you know, if if say suddenly they said, okay, you can all come out of your houses now on July 1, what could we actually offer and then it was like, there’s not going to be the same quality of festival. It’s not fair to our artists. It’s not fair to our audience. So the best and right thing to do was to cancel and look to 21 instead.

Phil Rickaby
Yeah. That I mean, that’s it. I think that it’s not, it wasn’t a surprise to anybody. I think everybody’s sort of like watching fringes and sort of waiting for the call. I think especially after Edinburgh cancelled, it started to look like well, they think they’re all they may all fall at least anything before September. And it’s really it’s really difficult to imagine In a summer without fringe or without any of the things that sort of make Toronto wonderful, but also that in because of this, and here we are, we’re still all in our houses, but we don’t have the opportunity as a theatre community to come together at PostScript or, or to meet in the line and things like that. But again, there’s nothing they

Lucy Eveleigh
know exactly. And, you know, we’re looking to what we’re going to do in that time instead, so that we can, you know, still have a community presence and connect with people. But I think, you know, as I was saying before, I feel like the psychological impact of this is going to be, it’s going to last much longer than even when they say, okay, it’s, it’s safe to go outside. I think, you know, we’re going to be so used to distancing ourselves from one another that it’ll be interesting to see how theoretics comes back from this.

Phil Rickaby
I think it’ll take a little bit of time. I don’t think that we can go from one day social distancing to the next day, being comfortable. In a theatre with 100 150 500 people,

Lucy Eveleigh
exactly. Yeah, exactly. It’s gonna take some time.

Phil Rickaby
Yeah. Yeah, I think that i think that that’s that’s and they say that it’s not going to be lifted all at once and it’s going to be a slow thing. So things like restaurants and movie theatres and theatres may take a little bit of time and also, it’ll take the artists time to ramp up again. So, you know, nothing can come back overnight. No. Yeah. In terms of you’re also the the president of the of the Canadian Association, association of fringe festivals. And so I was wondering what kind of conversations have you been having with the other fringes? Have you been giving advice? Have you been just offering a shoulder what kind of conversations are happening there as we as this goes on longer?

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, we’ve been sharing I mean, we meet once a week, the calf. Anybody who’s in CAFF, any member festival can join a conversation once a week that I’m You know, facilitating and we really are supporting one another through this, it’s been actually amazing. We don’t often connect with one another like this, you know, we have a conference once a year and we talk to various people throughout the year. But to connect like this in one group has actually been kind of beautiful because there is so much commonality obviously, and, and the people that, you know, in terms of Toronto, for instance, people that cancelled before us were able to sort of, you know, talk to us about their process, and we were able to pass that on to the people that cancelled after us and, and, you know, we will also wanted to have some uniformity about cancelling and trying to do things in a certain order and at what we were offering our artists obviously, every festival is different, and we don’t mandate what people are supposed to do, but certainly discussing what best practices were or what worked for one festival and then another festival would say, Oh, yeah, I like that idea. And, and mostly it’s been the support because, you know, running a Fringe Festival is a very unique thing. And you know, to be on a zoom call with 30 other people who will also fringe festivals across Canada and the states has been an incredible support to me and I think others and hopefully I have offered that support back to them. So yeah, it’s been it that’s been I mean, it’s it’s really sad when it’s like, yeah, we’ve cancelled yet we’ve cancelled. But it’s also the strength in the in the community that we felt that was pretty special.

Phil Rickaby
Mm hmm. Having the ability like having these regular conversations. Are there things that you’ve, you’ve learned even just outside of like, this whole social distancing situation, things that you’ve learned about the other fringes? Or even that this is something like do you feel that there will be a benefit in continuing to meet like,

Lucy Eveleigh
yeah, I mean, I think that you know, that this is a benefit that time has afforded us right, like usually there is no time to do these things because we’re all so busy running our festivals, you know, the circuit starts well with frigid in February, but the big tour usually starts with Orlando in May, and so people don’t have the time usually to meet one So I would say that’s been, I think it would be encouraging to be able to offer this support throughout the year. I mean, we do we have committees in Katherine, and the exact meets once a week. So there is that constant connection. But certainly, yeah, finding out, you know, not everybody always can come to the conference or meeting people that you don’t always get to see or other team members, there’s a couple of new people that have joined their fringes right at this moment. So that’s kind of strange for them to be navigated this time. But yeah, I think we have a pretty strong community there. And, and so that’s been really special. I think the communication has been, you know, those kinds of check ins, we do the same batana friends, we have a daily check in the management team, and it makes a huge difference, you know, it just kind of grounds you for the day.

Phil Rickaby
Well, without that it would be kind of a lonely existence in this fringe world not to connect with the team or with the other other fringes in some way.

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, and I think for a lot of the fringes, there are some You know, relatively small fringes and really is a one person team or a two person team or their volunteer led or something. So I think particularly for those smaller festivals, offering this kind of community and support has been invaluable, because yeah, it is it is lonely. It’s lonely, even when this lots who are doing it, you know, because, yeah, the pressure is on to kind of make these decisions for your artists. And that’s always the focus, right is wanting to do right by them. So, yeah, having strengthen, and turning to someone else, that’s also going through something similar has been very useful.

Phil Rickaby
I think, Well, I mean, talking about about how busy it is, and you know, the Toronto fringe team is a relatively large team as as some of the fringes go. And I mean, I know say for example, the funding fringes is for most of the year one person and as as as it gets closer than a lot of volunteers. So, you know, that’s sort of like like one thing. And then when the Toronto fringe gets gets ramped up, and you’re all you’re all so busy Is there even Is there a time Like when the fringe is happening for you guys to have a check in each day? Or is it just like so mad that, that you’re all off doing your own thing? And maybe running?

Lucy Eveleigh
I would say that we’ve got better at that. Like, certainly that’s something that we try and do. It’s tricky because people are working different hours we try. Most most departments have two people, so they trade off. So you’re not always on with the whole team. We try and have some kind of check in or, you know, we do like our dailies for that, you know, they get posted. So everybody knows who’s in the office when and we do you know, I think since the since we started using Slack, that’s been a real lifesaver in terms of communicating that way. So even if you don’t see each other face to face, you can have kind of team announcements and stuff like that. So we definitely utilise that a lot less certainly, you know, it’s it, there’s no denying it’s busy, I think we’ve got better, you know, my my goal is to really try and move away from this idea that without fringe who kind of is I’m talking about from the team’s point of view that you sort of work with The time and you burn yourself out. And then by day you’re like in a puddle. I’m not interested in that, you know, I think it’s trying to trying to run a fringe as healthily and as safely as possible is actually a challenge and it’s an it but it’s an important one to try and achieve. So that’s what we’re trying to focus on. the well being of the team, you know, yeah, it is stressful. You know, you’re dealing with a lot.

Phil Rickaby
Sure. And there’s a lot of heightened emotions, everybody, people who are putting on their shows, they’re, they’re heightened, and they’re frustrated, and they’re, they’re going through all of these things. And, and sometimes the fringe staff must take the brunt of that.

Lucy Eveleigh
Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah.

Phil Rickaby
But I mean, when like, because you’re talking about, like there being new, new processes to try to keep people from burning out was burnout for in earlier days of the fringe a real problem with

Lucy Eveleigh
Well, I think it’s just about the quality of the festival. And I think I think for me Just in general and, and in some ways Theatre in general, there’s this concept of like, you know, you work 24 seven and you kind of throw everything into it. And, you know, I did that. When I was in Edinburgh, I mean, Edinburgh is insane, like the amount of hours you work and late nights and. And I for me, I would say and I think people sort of wore it as a badge of honour of like, yeah, I’ve had three hours sleep and I’m still here and I’m committed and, and I understand where that comes from. And I and I get it to a certain degree, but I also think that you’re not necessarily doing your best work on day seven of three hours of sleep, right, sir? I think people survive it. And then it’s like, I was kind of saying, it’s like, giving birth where like, you go through and it’s like, terrible and then you go like, I’m gonna do that again. You know, because you forget immediately. Mm hmm. And because there’s so many highs during the fringe, right? Like it’s Oh, sure. And it’s, you know, you there is a camaraderie of everybody in it together. But I think what is getting better at being a bit healthier about it. And people still want to be part of that too and come back. So we’re very lucky to on a fringe we see quite a good retention in our staff and volunteers. Yeah. And because it’s it’s such a fun and beautiful place to work.

Phil Rickaby
Yeah. Um, now I know you’ve sort of mentioned that there are things that you that they’re you you want to have something for. That’s that’s fringe related as as the year goes on. I mean, of course, you’re not you’re not nobody’s gonna hold you to anything that you say here. Because it’s early days. Are there? Are there wild dreams that you have? Or things that might be possible? Are there? Are there ideas that you’re just sort of batting around? What kind of things are you thinking of?

Lucy Eveleigh
It’s funny, you should ask actually, because this morning, during our team meeting, we had started this conversation and I got very excited about the possibilities actually and felt very positive and hopeful. So tomorrow, actually We have, we’re bringing the artists together that are essentially the fringe 2020 cohort. So anybody who’s going to be infringed or sort of keeping together, and we’re going to talk to them tomorrow, and talk about, yeah, what we want to do, I think the idea at the moment, without going into too much detail, so definitely hold those dates the first to the 12th of July, and be able to offer something in the way of programming and the way in a sense of a virtual sort of patio experience. It’s not going to be 140 plays online that you can watch, it’s going to be a different result, because also, those artists have most of them are deferring to 2021. So we don’t sure you know, them to give away that show right now. So that we’re going to talk to them about what that alternative will look like. But we came up with a bunch of fun ideas today. So we’re gonna see, you know, we’re gonna throw a bunch of things at the wall and see what sticks, but I think we’re in an exciting sort of development time and just figuring out what’s possible, you know, so We have to think about revenues and expenses right now with all of the effects that COVID has had on

Phil Rickaby
us, of course, in terms of like, like, it’d be hard to get a fringe performer to try to put on their so virtually because they don’t have a stage in their home. The quality of the performance would be very different. But also, I was I was sort of looking at the at the fringe website, because one of the things that’s always sort of fun about the fringe is there’s there’s merge, there’s this sort of thing. But I noticed that I couldn’t buy fringe merge on the Toronto fringe website. Is that something because I’ve been trying to make it a policy lately of like, if there’s a company or an or an arts organisation that has merged, I’ll buy some. And I think that i think that that like, like, people would people would do that because we can’t tip the fringe in the same way that we could. So maybe if If we could buy, you know, a hat or a shirt or something that that maybe some of that might, might help. I don’t even know what the legit

Lucy Eveleigh
it’s just about somebody being in the office at some point to do that, because that’s for everything or in storage or whatever. Oh, of course. Yes. That’s a great idea. I mean, I think Yeah, usually we just sell the much during our festival time. And we have sold it online like, but again, when people are buying tickets, they can, you know, to call whatever so. But that’s a good idea to make that a bit more of a forefront if people did want to buy something right now that we could figure out what that would look like. Yeah, certainly some of our smaller items that easy to ship so Oh, sure. Like it’s like, yeah, we have piano pins. Yeah. So yeah, I think it’s, I think it is, you know, and when we do something in July, there will be like, ways of of some kind of revenue for the artists obviously, as a priority and some sort of opportunity to tip the fringe. I think the big thing is recognising that some of our artists for this code You know, this may have been their first kind of foray into producing theatre, so to expect them to do anything, like produce a show in their living room seems ridiculous and recognising well as we had earlier internet issues, or people don’t have internet or access to a webcam and, and so we’re really conscious of trying to create something that’s fair and equitable for everybody that’s involved this year.

Phil Rickaby
Yeah. There’s a lot of there’s a lot of a lot of questions and I really, I feel I you mentioned, like, fringe festivals that just joined the the Canadian Association of fringe festivals, what a year to be in that position to to be trying to ramp up for your first fringe in all of this.

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, I know. And, and the only good thing I think that’s come out of that is that they have got a chance to see this community of people that are there to support them. And you know, I think that will, it will a in some places the festivals exist, but there’s new staff members and in other places like in Peterborough was going to be the first indigenous festival and leave Who’s just joined us as you know, it has been on every meeting and and it’s been great to be able to meet them and have them meet us. And that’s been wonderful, but certainly, you know, probably not exactly what was planned, but at least there is this community that’s building and, and so that there’s some positives to come out of that because otherwise, sometimes you can feel a bit like you’re in it on on your own in your city, you know, yeah.

Phil Rickaby
Now, before decisions were, were made by a number of the festivals to to end there was some conversation among a lot of the a number of the touring artists about what they wanted, and I there was a letter that was written and signed and sent to the Canadian Association of fringe festivals. And you know, I think I think a lot I don’t know that everybody agree with everything that was in those in those those requests. But I think everybody, I think there was a difference. higher among everybody to just get some kind of statement from the fringe. Did you? Did you see that letter? And did you? Did you have a reaction to it?

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, I saw it. I wrote a response. I wrote back to them.

I yeah, we of course, we saw and it was discussed amongst caf and, and as the president, obviously, I was responsible for tanning in response and share that with the caf group before I returned it to the artist or he came through the sort of artist relations, so that got sent back to them. I never heard a follow up to my response. But, I mean, there was there was nothing in there that we weren’t already considering, you know, the only thing that you know, I mean, I, I believe that artists, you know, independent artists are, you know, incredibly vulnerable touring artists as well as local artists. Like I think it’s a horrible time for everybody. And for us, it was really about just kind of communicating the fact that calf is a festival that supports it is an organisation that supports festivals, you know, our primary focus is to support the festivals themselves. And then the festivals are responsible for supporting their artists. Obviously, there’s Blurred Lines there. And there’s been a lot more communication directly with cast, which is, you know, interesting and and, and that’s why we’ve kind of developed this artist relationships committee so that there is a more direct route for artists, especially the touring artist, because they are usually the ones that want to talk to me. But you know, there was, I mean, I think the thing for us is, it’s around education and going, not offering we’re not all going to come up with the same response. Not all festival is going to be able to do the same thing as all the festivals. Yes, we will have a certain mandate that we follow, but they’re all unique in their different ways of how they process things and fees and all of that kind of stuff. And Kathy isn’t interested in getting involved in the particulars of that. We’re there to support and to encourage and if they weren’t hearing if the touring artists were having an issue with not hearing back if any artist is having an issue not hearing back from the festival and not understanding, then they can write and let us know. So and So yeah, I mean, you know, I think there’s the, the, the main thing is that we’re all in it together, right? And we are all the fringe festivals exist to support these artists. And Caf is really an umbrella organisation to unite those festivals and to give those festivals a chance to come together and talk about that. And that each fest each festival is responsible for dealing with their artists, local touring, whatever. So, yeah, I mean, I understand I understand the insecurities in there and the fear that people were feeling and, you know, we’re always open to receiving any kind of feedback or any questions and you know, we, we turned around a response pretty quickly considering the what we’re all going through. But yeah, and I hadn’t I haven’t had a follow up. So I’m assuming everybody is sort of satisfied with that answer. I’m sure.

Phil Rickaby
I’m sure that if they weren’t, you would hear something. Yeah,

Lucy Eveleigh
I probably, you know, and again, it’s like it’s about different festivals responding to different artists as well. But yeah, we understand that, you know, the touring artists have a very unique kind of take on the fringe and a very unique relationship and investment. And so I understand where that’s coming from where that need of like, clarification from everybody is, is is required, but it’s just not always possible when you’re dealing with 33 different festivals across the states and Canada, you know?

Phil Rickaby
Yeah, I think it’s also it’s an important distinction to to think about that difference that that maybe isn’t always at the forefront is at the top of mind with think maybe of calf as the boss, whereas it’s not a you mentioned it as an umbrella. And it’s it’s like connecting the fringes and the fringes have to talk to or dealing with the artists on their basis with their bylaws and their their, their decisions. So yeah, I think it’s really simple and easy for some people. And a lot of us to sort of think, oh, calf is like at the top, but no calf is just sort of like the glue that’s holding these things and facilitating communication.

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, in in many ways. We’re more like an umbrella that’s upside down, you know, and all the festivals are sort of in us, because everybody at that table like Caf is running festival, like I might be the president, but I also run the trauma fringe. So, we all come together, we will all have everything we do with regards to Caf is, you know, in some cases is completely voluntary, you know, so yeah, there is no I’m certainly not the boss of fringe festivals. I I’m, I’m responsible for facilitating what happens in that room at the AGM and being the point person but everybody’s voice is just as important and, and I think there is an education piece in terms of that of like, what calf is there to do, which is to support the festivals who In turn, really are prioritising the artists. And then like I said at the beginning, there’s, there’s crossover with that. And I think it’s also just a reminder that like the cast business, it plays alongside all of our festival business, which is always going to be our priority, right? Because that’s what we do 24 seven so yeah, on top of that is, is the is the caf related stuff, which is important as well, but it’s, it’s, you know, it’s different

Phil Rickaby
in terms of like your workload, because for the Toronto fringe is obviously the thing that takes up most of your time. And when Toronto fringe ends, you’re into preparations for a next stage. And so it’s like this cycle that doesn’t quite stop for you. At what, how much of your time does Does, does the does calf take up and all of that? Or is it is it like a minor bit or is

Lucy Eveleigh
no, it’s, I mean, no, it depends. This past year was very, very busy with cat related stuff, and I think it’s because CAFF is does have more of a presence than it used to have. And so people are reaching out and asking questions and and knowing that they can get a response and, and having conversations. So it’s been great. It’s been a bit it definitely has been a lot of work in terms of, you know, as especially the cafe executive, you know, we do we do we deal with a lot of stuff and any kind of complaint or feedback comes to us at this point, or has through this point. So, yeah, on my regular work week, I can definitely stack up ours. You know, we write grants. Well, we have one staff member who works with us within caf and everybody else’s, you know, working on a from from a festival point of view, but we write grants and you know, to try and get funding for for certain initiatives and, and for our conference that we meet once a year and that takes some planning and with whichever festival is hosting it, so yeah, it can be it can add quite a lot of extra time, which I don’t mind obviously, I I you know, I chose to To run for this position and was elected and, and I’m very grateful and very honoured that there’s that kind of trust in me. And it’s been an incredible journey actually being part of this organisation. But yeah, it’s work it’s definitely it’s definitely, you know, when my time comes to step down and someone else takes over, I will make sure that they know that there definitely is a time commitment to this. That is important and and it plays into what I do at Toronto, French as well, you know, having the access to the caf exec is, is really crucial, I think, to decisions that I make within the Toronto fringe.

Phil Rickaby
Yeah. Difficult question about Toronto friends. And I mean, I’m not looking for specifics here. But what is the impact on fringe for not having a festival this year? Just because I want people to know like, what does that mean for the festival?

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, it’s not good. Obviously, you know, we are losing out on revenues. We were in a position fortunately that we hadn’t spent too much in terms of what we would normally spend for expenses for the festivals, our venues and costs related to staffing and patio and things like that. But certainly the core operations of the fringe is somewhat at risk, depending on what happens with certain funding things that I don’t know yet that, you know, certain applications that I have to make to things to, to bring some of that revenue back up to what we would like to get. But certainly, it’s, it’s gonna be we’ve got a lot of work to do to be able to make that out, and also to make sure that we’re strong for the future years, because obviously, deferring everybody to next year has an impact of financial impact on our 2021 fiscal So sure, yeah. You know, I mean, we’re waiting to hear about some grants and things like that and and, you know, we We are hopeful, but that it’s definitely going to have an effect. Yes. And it will be and also because I think fundraising is at risk for everybody, right, everybody is looking to raise funds and to honour fringes obviously, I think well positioned to, to be asking for donations because we do serve some of the most vulnerable artists, I think, but everybody is going to be people that normally donate may now be struggling financially themselves. And, and, and everybody’s going to be asking and you know, what makes one cause better than another? I think for us, it’s about reaching out to our donors, and asking those that can to still donate and, you know, those that can’t maybe go smaller than they would or, or, you know, try and find another way to support us spreading the word or something, but certainly there is obviously a financial implication to not running the festival this year. Yeah.

Phil Rickaby
In terms of the the 2020 cohort, and they’re deferring to Next year, is there? Have they all had to make that decision now? Or are they are they able to make that decision as the year goes on, because some of them may not be in a position to know what their financials are going to be like, next year?

Lucy Eveleigh
Yeah, well, we’ve been lost and amazing job in terms of working with the artists and creating a sort of exit form, as it were, from what was officially the 2020 Fringe Festival. And so we’ve offered all of our artists a refund, and writer first refusal to the 2021. So the up to a certain point, if you’re in the festival, basically at the point that we got cancelled, then you could either ask to have your money back right now. So you have it and still be in for next year. Or we can keep hold of your fee. So you don’t have to think about it again next year. And keep your place and if you decide in December, I think probably there’ll be a cutoff point before what would normally be the lottery. say if you now don’t want your sport to give it up and And that will be a different conversation. But, you know, so so we’ve been very, I think transparent about what we’re trying to do to make sure that those that need that money back can get that money back fairly easily. I mean, obviously, it takes some time to process that. But that’s happening as we speak. And yeah, and people still have access to do the festival, but it’s obviously going to affect our lottery numbers if we’re going to have way less slots available, not everyone will apply. And so those things we have to think about how we make up that kind of revenue.

Phil Rickaby
Yeah, that’s true. That’s true. In all of this as we all sort of struggle through our days and and and sort of sometimes feel a little buried by the the general anxiety in the world, where everybody looks to little things and finds little things to give them joy, things that give them life throughout the day. What are the things that are giving you joy and life

Lucy Eveleigh
Um my daughter She’s five. And so my partner and I are obviously homeschooling her to some degree of ability, who knows what she learned. But we’re lucky in some ways that she’s five and we don’t i don’t have to try and teach her some kind of complicated maths but she’s, that’s to me is like my bright spot I wish I could I think she’s finding it a bit difficult because a she’s an only child, so she’s kind of probably bored of her parents by now. So I’m right here working all the time. My day is still very full and I think she’s a bit late. You have another meeting, you have another meeting and so I want to be able to I’m over the next few weeks My goal is to try and split my day up a bit easier, so I could spend more time with her but, you know, honestly, it’s pretty pretty, pretty great to like, you know, come up with a call or have a have a tough time or whatever and then turn around and just do some colouring or, you know, make a calming jar or make some cookies. Whatever so having her here at home is a real blessing and she’s definitely helping me keep my sanity and and the team of French has been incredible it they’re so versatile and and willing to kind of work with what we have and stay positive and that’s incredible and we’re doing a bunch of like social things within the team as well which has been really important. And so yeah, I’m finding those things to be really helpful and you know, just staying connected with friends and trying to do at least one kind of social zoom or FaceTime or you know, texting friends that keep you sane. Yeah, that’s pretty great. And my partner’s a stand up comedian, so that keeps things pretty funny.

Phil Rickaby
That’s good. Well, Lucy, thank you so much and thanks for your patience with the technical difficulties and thank you for for Veit your candour and for for everything that you that you do both at the Toronto friends And and a calf.

Lucy Eveleigh
Oh, well thank you for likewise for everything you do and your support for the the arts community. It’s incredible. You know, I think Thank you. We’re really recognising how lucky we are in Toronto and in Canada with the with this with the community that we have and, and I appreciate what you do to highlight that. So thank you.

Phil Rickaby
Thank you.

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